If you hadn't noticed, the name of this thread is "Universal Myth plugin pack" which would appear to mean "one plugin including a set of Universal maps".
To your information: As far as I know this was the intention of the person who started this thread - but its nearly impossible for compatibility reasons (i.e. double tag names) to have ONE single plugin containing all the maps. It would also be very unflexible and confusing to use (100 maps to choose from in the game menu).
(...) You're still repackaging other peoples work and allowing it for download differently than how they produced it themselves. From the way you're talking and downloading things, you're doing it already. (...)
So you think selling the book of a dead author with a new cover is a copyright violation?
For your concerns: there is no update for the maps needed because (nearly) all of the groups or authors do not exist anymore in the myth community. And IF there should be an update, people who want the new file can just replace the old file because - as I already said - the plugins itself stay in their original file format.
The reason for one big download is simple: only 1 out of 20 people are willing to download 50 different files (usually from different places) and extract them all - they are just too lazy. If there is one big file to download and extract, things get easier.
And people who only want to have 2 of the plugins might also download these 2 files seperately. But a lot of people (including me) who are (re)installing Myth do not want do download 100 plugins and extract them all.
Btw, its not my fault when people host maps without a copyright information.
I also read on playmyth that Myth3 is getting or has gotten content download for it's next update. Why not just add that to myth2 and then people can get anything tehy want easy and none of this matters at all.
Feel free to code it into the engine, I would appreciate it.
Legally, you are bound to not take copyrighted work and profit from it without permission - or cause the copyright owner to lose potential profit. Of note in the case of Myth maps, 3rd parties may copyright their original art, sounds or text, but due to Bungie’s user agreement for Fear & Loathing, the plugins themselves can not be copyrighted by 3rd parties. Also, very few map makers actually went to the trouble of placing a copyright on their colormaps or whatever.
Realistically, the only legal issue here would be something like having a site that freely distributed the copyright owner’s work while the copyright owner was selling the same somewhere else, such as to Take 2, for instance. In such a case, you would be liable for what the copyright owner lost in revenue (not a very profitable market for Myth maps these days, I’m afraid) and something like a $250 fine. Not something I would worry about too much, especially since that once the copyright owner made his work available for free elsewhere, they’d have a hard time proving any financial damages.
An exception might be something like the Mill, were it still around, generating advertising revenue by hosting free maps. If the Mill then had a contract for exclusivity with the copyright owner, it could get complicated. But even in real world cases like that, it’s very rare that it ever becomes a legal issue because it’s just not worth the time and money.
True, corporate giants like Disney or Coca-Cola often sue just to win the $250 fine and prove a point, but their logos, or whatever, are worth millions of dollars. Metallica might come after you if you download one of their songs for free, but you can easily understand how, on a large scale, they’re losing lots of money when people don’t buy their music, so they also waste a lot of time and money to prove a point. To put Myth maps that were always available for free in the same category by discussing legalities is just a little ridiculous.
Ethical concerns are a little different though.
You shouldn’t plagiarize, meaning take someone else’s work and tell everyone it’s yours, but obviously that’s far from your intentions.
You shouldn’t alter an author’s work without their permission. If you do alter it, make it clear to the public what you have done, so if it sucks, they blame you and not the original author.
You shouldn’t misrepresent the author’s work. For example, telling people a WWII plugin is actually a Lord of the Rings conversion and that they should download it.
You should, of course, respect the author’s wishes.
If available, check the readme file. Sometimes authors will state their wishes there, and if so, you should respect them.
It would be polite to contact the author with your intentions if you have their email address. It would be polite to say please and thank you when you email them too. If you have their email address and don’t do these things, you’re not being polite. Yes, sorry to overstate the obvious, but there are those who, for whatever reason, will try to convince you that a breach of etiquette is tantamount to cardinal sin. You may politely ignore them.
Especially rude, however, is ignoring the author once they have expressly made their wishes known to you. If an author asked you not to include their work in this compilation, and you ignored them, then they would have every reason to be mad at you. Even if contacted after the compilation is already being distributed, you would be ethically bound to cease distributing it. You could always re-offer it sans the plugin(s) in question, however.
The not so obvious part to all this is what if you have no way to learn of the author’s intentions. What if the author wished that his map only be used by naked players? Or fully clothed? My God, you can’t ethically even think about the map if you’re going to throw in all sorts of weird what-ifs - so you just make the best guess you can.
Here’s my guess. Call me crazy, but:
Most authors made and distributed their maps for other Myth players to enjoy. Some - but far from all - did it to get their name recognized. The later, did or should have, put his name in the pregame art as well as the read-me.
So in either case, there is no ethical breach by redistributing these maps. Anyone who talks about presentation really has another agenda - or is so absurdly full of themselves, that don’t worry, they’ll find and contact you instantly if you listed their work alphabetically when they wanted it chronologically, or whatever.
If you feel the above is still too confusing or maybe open to interpretation, and you just don’t want a hassle, here’s a simpler guideline: don’t include Clem’s maps in the compilation.
Phex wrote:CLASSIC / REGULAR
? Creep on the Borderlands
* Caer Cadarn (Caer_Cadarn)
? Shuffle off this Mortal Coil
? Barbarian Valley T.E.
* Phoenix Rising (Phoenix Rising)
? The Barrens Venice
* Fosgarach Ruillick 2 (Fosgarach_Ruillick_v2)
* Krakatoa (Krakatoa v1.3)
? Rank and Defiled
* The Great Divide (The Great Divide v1.0) X Calm Before the Storm (already part of Thaw Before the Storm)
* Thaw Before the Storm (thaw)
? Tamaerlin
? Acts of Piety
* Lichen Unto Death (Lichen_Final)
* Hvergelmir (Hvergelmir v1.4)
* Smells Like Death In Here (Smells_1.1G )
* Dun Caric (Dun_Caric)
* Boil and Bubble (boilandbubble)
* To Kill a Mockingbird (mockingbird_v1.0)
* Sleepy Hollow (sleepyho)
* Gothic (Gothic v1)
? Tallow Abbey X Cryptic Wightings (already part of Gothic)
* Leagues from Nowhere (Leagues from Nowhere)
? The Grass Between Your Teeth
* Green Acres (GreenAcres)
? Who's Your Daddy?
? Run Home & Cry To Momma!
* Myopia (Myopia_v1.2)
? Wasteland
? Ashes to Ashes
* Mjilaphobia (Mjila)
* Morte Della Luna (Morte Della Luna 1.0)
* Gravediggers (GraveDiggers)
* A Shattered Visage (A Shattered Visage)
* Going to Town (Going_to_Town)
*c TFL Solos (Magma - The Fallen Levels v2)
* TFL Multis (Magma TFL Multipack)
*c Group of Coops 2 (Group of Coops#2)
* Eyrie (Eyrie)
* Frostbite (Frostbite)
*c Under Myrkidian Standards (UMS v1.0)
*c Throne of the Lich King (Throne of the Lich King)
*c Dol Baran 2 (Magma - Dol Baran v2.0)
*c 5 Legends (Magma - Five Legends SB, Magma - Five Legends TFL)
*c Scourge of Belial (Magma - Scourge of Belial)
* Till the Morning's End (Till the Morning's End v1.2)
* The Barrens (The Barrens 1.2)
back to phex's list:
only maps i see missing are red sands black blood, and rain on the borogrove.
i'd argue that dispite the bungie connection, going to town, cryptic wightings and gothic are not great maps... although wouldn't hurt to include them.
i cannot find(and have never played):
-grass between your teeth
-who's your daddy
-til the mornings end
-wasteland
i am not sure what the end desire is here. that magma makes and hosts this giant .zip?
out of curiosity, i made a archive of the ffa maps from the link list above and the team maps. the ffa archive is about 50mb and the team is about 60mb. purplePeopleEater (who hosts mythforums.com) may be willing to create two archives of roughly that size. he was very open when i spoke with him about using his links.
for what its worth, bloo said he plans to add that link list to the pmnet page that identifies pure maps. in order to make it complete, if anyone knows where to find the maps i was missing, let me know. i think PPE will be happy to host them.
If someone put the list together as a zip, we'd be very happy to host it here. It'd make sense for it to be prominent on all the main Myth sites, along with links to everywhere it was hosted/mirrored.
iron wrote:If someone put the list together as a zip, we'd be very happy to host it here. It'd make sense for it to be prominent on all the main Myth sites, along with links to everywhere it was hosted/mirrored.
i could send the 2 zips i made to you, but would like to see if i can track down the maps i noted that are missing... i still hope that someone has those plugs and can post them or mail them to me.
when i added the maps that are on phex's list, but are not pmnet pure maps, the ffa pack is 78mb and the team pack is 68mb. this could be evened out, since many of the ffa maps have 2start meshes. i would also add the preview interface i've linked to, which would add about 2mb.
sorry, I don't know where those missing maps are either. I know Grass Between Your Teeth was Phish's last map, made just before myth 3 was released.
As for transfering, the easiest way would be to upload it on udoghl (which is the same server as magma.net) and we can transfer it to the best location on the server once its up.
1) I just noticed there is one awesome (!) map missing: A seperation of Ages by Creation, which consists of two plugins: River of Live and River of Gold, both solo and multi. I have to original file, but you can also sownload it here from the-package.
2) I have, can & will send Till the Morning's end to you soon. EDIT: sent it to you.
You have not requested any permission to use any Creation work which I produced or primarly contributed to. You do not have permission to include any of my work in your archive. I will distribute my maps on my own websites and via archive websites like The Mill or Playmyth.
I'm sure your archive will be very successful and popular without my hack projects dragging the quality level down.
Well, clem has posted under his own name to request his maps not be included. As much as it makes me roll my eyes, his request should be honored.
igmo, if you're putting this together and planning on Project Magma hosting this compilation then I would suggest removing clem's maps. I can't say I'm very familiar with his work, but I think I saw at least one of his maps in the list. Since clem is following this thread, perhaps he can be so kind as to point out which in the list are his in order to ensure his maps are not wrongfully represented.
ChrisP wrote:Well, clem has posted under his own name to request his maps not be included. As much as it makes me roll my eyes, his request should be honored.
igmo, if you're putting this together and planning on Project Magma hosting this compilation then I would suggest removing clem's maps. I can't say I'm very familiar with his work, but I think I saw at least one of his maps in the list. Since clem is following this thread, perhaps he can be so kind as to point out which in the list are his in order to ensure his maps are not wrongfully represented.
Ah..I didn't see that post. I was reading off of the list. It also includes River of Gold and I also believe it is the map that 'Lead a Hoor to Water' is set on. I could be wrong.
