Hey Killery -- Read your PM's!

[Baak]

to rate in an abusive way

I am arguing that this does not exist. How they choose to rate it (however that is) is within their right to rate it.

Disagree. There's a HUGE difference between your own personal rating and rating something in an abusive manner. Killery's rating of StoneHeart RDF is the perfect example. His personal rating is 3-stars -- fine. He rated it 1-star in order to make the overall rating become his personal rating of 3-stars.

That's the difference.

[Edit: I think I posted this after you already came to this realization... ]

I agree reviews of Killery's caliber are non-productive but every single solution you have proposed eliminates the feedback they have chosen to provide, in particular it eliminates their ability convey dislike for the plugin.

Again: People can provide whatever REVIEWS they want. They can say: "THIS MAP SUCKS" and nothing else. That's about as liberal as you can get.

Then when people read the REVIEWS they can MAKE THEIR OWN DECISION by weighing all the REVIEWS.

Good reviews with good reasoning can be weighed against bad reviews with bad reasoning, and everything in between. Reviews like: "THIS MAP IS GEI" can be ignored whereas the ratings from a review like this cannot.

The star ratings can be abused. The reviews cannot.

That's all I'm saying.

[GonenGuard]

I don't know, Baak: You have a history of being extraordinarily defensive when anyone dares rate a product of yours less than 4 stars. You enjoy acting the diplomat and all that but you are clearly and deeply invested in approval.

As proof of this, no doubt at this very moment you are summoning all kinds of energy to leave me a lengthy, labyrinthine, 4,000-word defense and counterpoint to what I just said, with bullet points, footnotes, and formulae.

Right?



But *having* said that, Killery is an obvious asshole. All people like him are obvious assholes. He's dense, obtuse, and arrogant. To leave the kind of "reviews" he has left is no more than disruption and subterfuge. The stupid fuck didn't even know the difference between "Cryptic Wightings" and "Gothic".

I have attempted to correct him where necessary.

[vinylrake]

you are responding to an almost 2 year old post?

Unless you have more than Baak's reactions to Killery's reviews (which you have already acknowledged are bogus) of Baak's plugins in mind, saying that baak has "a history of being extraordinarily defensive when anyone dares rate a product of yours less than 4 stars" is a completely BS allegation.

just to make sure i wasn't forgetting some meltdown by baak about reviews of his plugins i looked back through the forum archives back as far as Spring 2007 (i got bored at that point) and the only ratings-related post(s) by baak i saw were related to Killery's irresponsible ratings.

so i have to ask, troll much?

[GonenGuard]

Ah, a minion. I remember you, minion Vinyl. Seems like mostly a pleasant memory, but I could be wrong.



However, if "history" for you goes back merely to 2008...well, then, I daresay you're late to the party, my friend. By half a decade, plus. In that time---and before---Baak has indeed, at every turn, exhibited extremely defensive, painfully meticulous responses to any negative view of his work. It's as if anyone who finds his stuff derivative, redundant, or compulsive must *of course* be wrong for some reason, or has simply not become a properly indoctrinated minion. Yet.

Look at this thread, my friend.

And perhaps due to minions such as yourself, Baak has this idea that his work is the single greatest, most fun thing ever made for Myth. Well, it is not. My opinion, of course, which means nothing in the long run. I am but a janitor in a large investment firm, eating stewed tomatoes from a can.

Anyway, I could care less, and I'm on vacation, so that's probably it for me around here. Except that I would dearly appreciate someone making 1.4.x films compatible with 1.7.x releases.

*Horrible* days for Myth, that 1.4 era.

[Pyro]

I don't think Gonen was trolling (at least not on purpose), but I also don't know what he is referring to unless something Baak said/did several years ago that was not left behind in a forum that is still around.

VR, isn't some minion. He just defended someone he sees has done nothing wrong to receive what VR might see as an attack (insult or whatever). VR mentioned searching the forums because from the point of view of people that are more likely to remember the more recent years, this thread is the only evidence or example of Baak being upset about someone's opinion of his stuff.

People will see things differently based on what they know and have seen. Gonen saw something that made him think Baak cares too much about others' opinions of his work. VR on the other hand has not seen that or if he has seen some of it, he has been around to see positive things and therefore sees Baak differently. Both were a bit aggressive without taking into account there was more to the other person before jumping into conclusions.

[Graydon]

That said, the fact that an account was created simply for the purpose of bumping a 2 year old post long forgotten.... It's almost the definition of trolling.

[Pyro]

Yeah, it appears that way, but not everything is what it appears to be. This is an example of what I mean. While he made his first post in this thread, his account is not new (not made within days of posting I mean). In fact I noticed some week or so back he has been making reviews for several submissions on the Tain. So maybe he made that account to make reviews mainly but then stumbled onto some specific thread (about Tain reviews) that he felt like replying to. Or maybe it was the other way around, he read the thread and he decided to make an account to make reviews only to eventually reply to that thread. Or just some long time inactive Myther who walked back in and decided to make an account.

[Baak]

Haven't been on for awhile and saw this at the very top. Bizarre!

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I'm not quite sure what his is/was? Just kinda sounds like a rant? And I have no idea what he is talking about regarding the alleged history to which he refers (I'm assuming he's a he btw). He didn't even seem to read the post before his where I say it's fine that someone rated something 3 but not fine they rated it 1 to make the overall rating in-line with theirs.

The most interesting thing to me is the fact that it's been almost two years since the original thread. Wow. Time does indeed fly.

Hey, GonanGuard: why not start a new thread about something more interesting? Or mb make something cool Myth-related? Or mb just play some Myth instead?

[Pyro]

Yeah that is actually something I bet Gonen would agree on, judging by a few reviews I saw where he purposely rated something 5 star (while stating he would have rated it lower otherwise) just to counter killery's attempt to bring the overall rating down.

I noticed them when I set the Tain submissions in order from top rated to least. Then skip more than ten pages to get to the stuff rated 3 stars and lower, as those are more likely to have a varying range of ratings. Since a 5 star normally has just either one 5 star review or multiple ones. A 3 star might have a 1 star and a 5 star.

As strange as it may sound, I sometimes tend to seek out the lower rated reviews to see why they thought something wasn't that great.

[vinylrake]

"GonenGuard",

"minion", nice attempt to dismiss my comments without actually rebutting it with any evidence. Want to try again?

Fwiw, my "history" goes way back past 2007, but unlike some people who like to make allegations without any evidence to back up their opinions, I acknowledge that my memory isn't infallible so I like to check my facts and make sure I am not misremembering. Obviously if Baak has "a HISTORY of being extraordinarily defensive when anyone dares rate a product ... less than 4 star" there would be some record of it, right? So - although I didn't remember any cases where Baak sounded overly defensive about any of the things he's made OTHER than this thread about this one person's ratings which you acknowledged are BS, I went back through the forum post history and skimmed all Baak's posts over the past 4+ years. I thought that was a reasonable time span and it's obviously way more fact checking then you did.

"Look at this thread, my friend." - yes, everyone agrees Baak was defensive about Killery's ratings, and we all agree it was pretty warranted given that Killery didn't even try some (all) of the plugs he rated poorly. You yourself said Killery rating baak's plugin so low was him being an ahole. So objecting to one player's bogus ratings isn't a "history of being extraordinarily defensive when anyone dares rate a product less than four stars"..

If you want to show a pattern/history of overly defensiveness , try giving more than one thread about a person who gave bad ratings without even trying out the plugins. Until then, shut up. in other words, put up or shut up, if you keep making accusations without any evidence you are merely trolling. Which from your tone I am guessing is not an uncommon activity for you.

[vinylrake]

I don't think Gonen was trolling (at least not on purpose), but I also don't know what he is referring to unless something Baak said/did several years ago that was not left behind in a forum that is still around.

From his tone, he obviously has some issue with Baak. Notice how he infers a condescending attitude on baak's part when he says Baak is overly defensive when anyone "dares" rate his plugins lower than 4 stars? Playing armchair psychologist, and not knowing who "gonen" is, I would guess he is a mapmaker or possibly just an aspiring(wannabe) mapmaker who either doesn't feel he is getting the credit HE deserves for his own creations, or because he has some grand ideas of things he would like to make but because he has no mapmaking skills himself is frustrated and jealous that Baak is able to actually finish projects and that people enjoy playing them - he feels his own ideas are much better but they will never get their due... -- of course that's just having fun playing armchair psychoanalysis, i am sure that reality is quite different.

VR, isn't some minion. He just defended someone he sees has done nothing wrong to receive what VR might see as an attack (insult or whatever). VR mentioned searching the forums because from the point of view of people that are more likely to remember the more recent years, this thread is the only evidence or example of Baak being upset about someone's opinion of his stuff.

Pyro, obviously you are just saying that because you are MY minion. Well done, my good and faithful minion. You take the rest of the day off.

[Pyro]

You take the rest of the day off.

Thank you mastah.


To me Gonen sounds like someone who used to play long ago and recently came back. Would explain why he might know of Baak (from the past) and why he might know Killery (the present). Baak isn't very active these days to even come off sounding like what Gonen claims. While Killery does actively play every now and again and sometimes the things I see him say don't make a whole lot of sense. Some of which is probably language barrier related. Or maybe on Gonen's Tain review spree he read one too many of Killery's reviews that made him have a low opinion of him.

[ozone]

I rate this thread ZERO stars. I feel less of a human for reading it. Thanks.

[vinylrake]

For a robot, that's a pretty negative evaluation.

[Baak]

I rate this thread ZERO stars. I feel less of a human for reading it. Thanks.

Don't blame us, Ozone -- we weren't the ones who revived it after almost two years! Although we're doing a good job keeping it alive now...

Would be nice if threads older than X months (mb 12?) auto-locked.