Page 2 of 3
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:23 pm
by woof
Horus â„¢ wrote:Current news is that the US has refused a great many offers of aid from outside the US...
Canada, Holland, Russia, Iran and China included...
WTF!!
Edit: Here's what I'm talking about
Being kept from the American people have been the uncounted offers of assistance from Nations all around the world, including: Venezuela has offered their Medical Airlift Command for the evacuation of peoples trapped in these devastated regions; Holland has offered the resources of their Public Works Ministry (and who are the acknowledged World Experts for below sea level water evacuation procedures); Russia has offered over 100,000 temporary living structures, along with Military Personal to assist their American counterparts; Iran has offered 1 Billion US Dollars in immediate assistance and guaranteed 5,000,000 barrels of oil at $35.00 US Dollars; China has offered their Military Rescue Forces (Who are acknowledged as one of the best in the world for rescuing peoples in flood ravaged areas.)
All of these offers, and more, the Military Leaders of the United States have declined, and for the their previously stated reason: “The United States Government and its People Respectfully Decline your offer of assistance and refer you to our previous State Department Bulletin (NCO:13788) in which we had stated that this remains an internal action.â€
And another bit from a more reliable source
On tonight's news, CTV (Canadian TV) said that support was offered from Canada. Planes are ready to load with food and medical supplies and a system called "DART" which can provide fresh water and medical supplies is standing by. Department of Homeland Security as well as other U.S. agencies were contacted by the Canadian government requesting permission to provide help. Despite this contact, Canada has not been allowed to fly supplies and personnel to the areas hit by Katrina. So, everything here is grounded. Prime Minister Paul Martin is reportedly trying to speak to President Bush tonight or tomorrow to ask him why the U.S. federal government will not allow aid from Canada into Louisiana and Mississippi. That said, the Canadian Red Cross is reportedly allowed into the area.
Bush needs to get over his Crusade already and help New Orleans.
The U.S. isn't short on supplies or technology. It's access thats the problem. Right now air transportation is the dominate method. You can only put in so many flights in a region under the best of circumstances.
It's very nice that other countries are offering assistance. Im sure that New Orleans and the rest of the affected areas will accept some of the offers. But jeeez guys, it's a logistical nightmare.
I don't like Bush, but holy fook, rampant politicization and suggestions that Bush is somehow plotting with "Military leaders" to deny supplies to N.O. is fucking stupid. Get a grip.
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:28 pm
by woof
OK, I've become rude. Sorry. I'll be quiet now.
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:48 pm
by William Wallet
"It's a fucked up situation - no other way to express it."
No no, I'm with you there PP.
And I wish people wouldn't see it as though I'm saying the govt. isn't doing anything about it, and that this is our big chance to rag on Bush. I could care less about him at the moment.
My point is, more can be done. No bloody miracle quick fix, because this is going to take a long damned time to recover from, but I think more can be done. That's all.
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:57 pm
by carlinho
it's funny how fast they can send resources and men when it's about money and power and oil and how slow when it's about people with no economic resources...
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 10:03 pm
by CIK
I think the best summary is the federal government was on vacation. Bush didn't bother to get off his butt until Wednesday himself. And it wasn't until the TV stations started showing the disaster that they realized the size of the problem and actually started moving. Many lives have been lost because of the delay but at this point there is little that can be done other then send money to reputable organizations.
Now that they are moving things will get better, it is just the frustration that it took so long for them to get moving. But even now is will take months before order returns.
Even still Bush's relucance to deploy the military is just embarrashing. 90% of the military troops being deployed are the "National Guard". For folks outside the US these are people who work regular jobs and play solider 2 weeks a year in return for some extra spending money and when the government needs them they get uprooted and sent somewhere. I just have to ask what's wrong with the regular military forces. I've seen verifed info that only 1/4 of them are involved in the mess over seas...are the rest of them all AWOL or what.
Anyways:
To give you an idea, the governor of Mississippi flew over a 50 mile stretch of coast land which contain move then a few community and in that 50 miles he didn't see a single structure still standing. And that was just one area.
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 11:23 pm
by guest
carlinho wrote:it's funny how fast they can send resources and men when it's about money and power and oil and how slow when it's about people with no economic resources...
actually, southern louisiana has one of the largest reserves of oil in the US.
this disaster has sucked ass.
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 11:30 pm
by CIK
Very correct, the flow of oil & gas has been greatly disrupted in the US. Which is going to cause some serious issues for the other 90% of the country. In fact I last payed $2.47 for gas the last time I filled out over a week ago. Today I got out and found most gas stations where charging $3.19 and one was even $3.49. News is reporting areas close to the disaster the price is over $5.
Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2005 11:33 am
by Silent
The clerks at my local gas station told me that they will be selling gas at $6/gallon next week. Unbelieveable.
Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2005 12:34 pm
by Pistol_Pete
Galveston was bad. Katrina's effects are way larger. Maybe or maybe not in a death toll of 6 @ 000--who knows at this point--but in lives affected,Katrina pwnD.
I see your point. The damage - from the human toll to the economic loss - must be staggering.
I accept that any criticism I give of the situation is Monday morning quarterbacking; however+great warning signs were given to the government:
In 2001, FEMA warned that a hurricane striking New Orleans was one of the three most likely disasters in the U.S. But the Bush administration cut New Orleans flood control funding by 44 percent to pay for the Iraq war.
spiegel
I don't think it's fair to pin the blame for that solely upon Bush; the government is more than one man. Bush shouldn't have voided the ban on developing wetlands. I'm betting that others have made bigger mistakes involving Katrina.
As to your point that " A lot of these broken levis have been chronically underfunded. And we all know where many of the U.S.'s guardsmen are..."
Lack of National Guard is not the problem. It's ACCESS and mobilization. Roads are impassible or destroyed or flooded. Airports are destroyed or overcrowded. It will take time.
Point taken.
As to the levees, taxpayers didnt want to fund the billions it would take in upgrades.
I don't know of any referendum over the levee funding. This was a situation few took seriously until it was too late.
---
Oh, I don't think you're being rude, woof. Your candid wisdom might sound harsh, when you reread it, but I apprecaite you doing your best to be honest.
...and you're forgetting that I'm mostly French, woofie. 
Edited By Pistol_Pete on 1125769605
Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2005 12:52 pm
by Archer
Silent wrote:The clerks at my local gas station told me that they will be selling gas at $6/gallon next week. Unbelieveable.
Welcome to what Europe has been paying all along.
~J
Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2005 2:36 am
by woof
Pistol_Pete wrote:Oh, I don't think you're being rude, woof. Your candid wisdom might sound harsh, when you reread it, but I apprecaite you doing your best to be honest.
...and you're forgetting that I'm mostly French, woofie.
Mon Ami, Pistolet Pete!
Distillateur allez-vous balader ce printemps ?
Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2005 9:59 am
by Pistol_Pete
Archer wrote:Welcome to what Europe has been paying all along.
~J
Raw deal. If the US got the plentiful vacaction time, or the cheaper health care of Europe, I'd be happy, but we shouldn't only get a European con. Next, you're going to tell me David Hasselhoff is a major pop star in America...
Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2005 10:03 am
by Pistol_Pete
woof wrote:Mon Ami, Pistolet Pete!
Distillateur allez-vous balader ce printemps ?
Sadly, I am unable to understand French. My grandmother last spoke French back in roughly 1910, and since then, nobody has spoken it. Cultural assimilation + lazy Pete = monoligual Pete. 
Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 4:22 am
by Industry
Its $6 a gallon in Europe because of the massive taxes levied in Europe on gasoline to discourage the ownership of personal vehicles. On the flip side, in Europe I'm pretty sure you can take a train just about anywhere, whereas in the U.S. you can take an expensive, frequently hours late, thread worn Amtrak coach just about nowhere.
Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 4:37 pm
by Pistol_Pete
Industry: I lived in London for a bit, and in my travels through "Old Europe," I saw how public transportation should be done; however, I must admit I nearly kissed my steering wheel when I got home. Giving up the ability to travel upon your own whim and schedule is a difficult thing, but it might be a wise idea, to help out future generations.
...okay, no more off-topicness from me.