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Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 3:21 am
by carlinho
sorry I make so many questions, just want to be ready to FEAR once I finish ambering some new units.
SO I have this Phoenician Axeman, that has on his right hand an axe and on his left a dagger.
here's a still:
http://carlinho7.tripod.com/id7.html
He basically stabs with the dagger on the left and immediatelly strucks a blow with his axe on his right.
I could do in amber an animation that has both attacks and then do 1 simple attack in fear that will make blood appear on the axe blow.
But how could you set it up in fear so both attacks work independently but happen 1 after the other, so basically you see blood on both and both inflict damage?
the dagger being able to be blocked, the axe one can't...
thanks, and sorry to bugger....oh bugger...
Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 4:16 am
by Pyro
Well no standard unit can do that but I think there are some ways... one way would be to have two melee attacks... one for each. The first would require mana (that could be invisible to make it more melee like) and have it restore at a certain rate where you can do this: Axe attack... then not enough mana for another so Dagger attack... now enough mana so Axe attack and so on. Is it clear or should I explain it some more?
Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 4:32 am
by carlinho
thanks Pyro, I get the idea, but let's say the unit is commanded by the computer, as in this case it will be an enemy unit in a singleplayer.
How can you set up those attacks so it's automatic and doesn't need you to script it with use special ability or anything weird, but just happens by itself?
Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 4:47 am
by Pyro
With the method I mentioned no scripting is required at all... not even special attacks.
Axe Attack - melee attack requires certain amount of mana
Dagger Attack - melee attack requires no mana
Say mana is 20.
Unit has full mana.. 20
Attacks with Axe and uses all of it.
Now attacks with Dagger and meanwhile the mana is back to full.
Unit attacks with Axe again.
Then Dagger.
Etc.
Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 9:19 am
by Zeph
pyro stole myth words, so instead of im going to complete.
In monster flags, there's an extanded section that you probably knew already. One of them is "mana isnt shown" or something close to that. That's what you want to be using.
Both of your attacks need to be set to primary attack with all the same range and everything except the dagger strike that needs x amount of mana.
You give that units x amount of mana and a mana regeneration of like 0.5 (that would be a good number for 100 mana)
What happens is :
Unit has 100% mana
strikes with dagger, uses up all mana
unit has not enough mana for dagger attack
unit strikes with axe
by the time he has struck with axe, mana is replenished
repeat...
Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 12:45 pm
by Horus
OR
Rather than letting the mana take it's time to restore, just set the axe attack as -whatever.
For example
unit has 100 mana
He attacks with Dagger which uses 100 mana
He can't attack with mana anymore so he attacks with axe, axe has a requirement of -100 mana so it restores the used mana letting him attack with the dagger again.
Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 3:09 pm
by carlinho
HA!
What would I do without all your help!
thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 3:54 pm
by Zeph
Horus that's a GREAT idea 
so no mana regen.
Dagger takes 100% mana
Axe takes -100% mana
nice nice
Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 10:41 pm
by William Wallet
Mana??? Hahahah, I would've used negative ammo like IronDuke... but if it works, go for it.
Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 7:14 pm
by Gleep
Or, you could just use the same projectile and attack for both the dagger and axe attacks but have two seperate sequences. Then you could change the sequence skip fraction so half the time it plays the dagger animation and half the time the axe animation. Make sure repetitions is set to 2. Since you want the attacks close together this shouldn't be a problem. No pesky mana or anything.
Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 8:53 pm
by carlinho
actually that's really interesting Gleep....
How would you need to set up that in detail?
would you need to do 2 different sequences in amber?
the repetitions with half one and half the other would it be set up in fear?
clicking which keys?
thanks !!!!
Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:10 pm
by Pyro
Well carlinho, the reason the people before Gleep didn't suggest that is that you wanted the Axe attack to be unblockable but the dagger attack to be blockable... therefore each would have to be a different projectile. But if you don't care if they are the same type of attack and same damage... look into the Myrk's and the Heron Guard's attacks. The Myrk uses one of the attack sequences to attack with the left arm... but half the time only. The rest of the time it will pick the other attack sequence which is the right arm.
With Fear you pick both sequences. But with Amber you will have to make sure there are two attack sequences... Axe and Dagger.
Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 12:39 am
by carlinho
Hey Pyro, don't get me wrong, I'm doing the attack the way you guys said, with mana, I still couldn't make it work somehow.
MAybe it's because I'm using an old os9 fear in a mac, and I'm using a monster tag I did in a pc with the latest fear, so I'm going to copy again to the pc the new local and keep trying.
But just wanted to know that other method by using repetitions, because it looks interesting for other units I want to do...
specially the thing it alternates at percentages you could fix.
I still didn't understand how do you do that...apart from setting 2 different attack sequences in amber which I have....
Thanks for the help everybody!
Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 12:51 am
by carlinho
Actually I found out that mana is only used in each attack when attacks are marked as "special ability"
when I use an attack as "is primary attack" the mana doesn't get used in each blow...
I guess there's a way around this, if not then the alternative is either using ammunition...instead of mana?
Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 3:41 am
by Pyro
carlinho wrote:Actually I found out that mana is only used in each attack when attacks are marked as "special ability"
when I use an attack as "is primary attack" the mana doesn't get used in each blow...
I guess there's a way around this, if not then the alternative is either using ammunition...instead of mana?
I think you made a mistake... I went and did some testing of my own... here I even made a plugin for you to look at as an example. I modifed a myrk to have 100 mana, 0 mana recharge, its first attack uses 100 mana, the second attack uses -100 mana, under the "flags" section I checked "Use Extened" and "Mana Isn't Shown". I placed 4 of these myrks into Willow Creek for your ghast killing enjoyment... I mean mana using attack testing. 
EXAMPLE for Carlinho
When you post, let me know if you have download it. So I can delete it.
Your mistake could have been that you have the attack use mana but you didn't give the monster any mana... or something else you might have forgotten. BTW... I used Fear 1.5.1 on the PC incase it matters.