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Anyone know the stats for how the TSG tagset units vet? Normal units only need 5 kills to max out, but using TSG tagset on the regular m2 levels, the archers seem to vet up for quite a ways. i had an archer with 16 kills that was shooting noticeably faster than 2 arcs with 12 kills. for every 4 arrows the 12 kill arcs shot, the 16 arc shot 5. Just curious if anyone knows where I can find the stats on this stuff.

I doubt there's anything special going on. TSG was created on v1.3 of Myth 2, and at that time 'custom vetting limits' didn't exist. So almost certainly all units still cap out at the default 5 kills. There can be randomizing factors for attacks (rate of fire, recovery time etc) that could indeed make one arch shoot a notable amount quicker or more accurately, but ultimately he's still 'just as good' as the guy next to him.

Unless when TSG v1.4 was released custom vet limits were added to units..... but I HIGHLY doubt Clem would've authorized Baak to do that when he authorized the 1.4 update.

Graydon wrote:...Unless when TSG v1.4 was released custom vet limits were added to units..... but I HIGHLY doubt Clem would've authorized Baak to do that when he authorized the 1.4 update.

Baak is really good about documenting his modifications and I don't recall any conversation about that.

Well, try it out for yourself. Play willow creek or something and let your arcs vet up. They shoot fast. Literally halfway in between arc hero speed and regular archer speed. Also noticed the dwarven pathfinder has 2 airstrike specials instead of satchels, and he vets up so that he can throw again before his first bottle reaches the ground. I'm guessing they capped it at 20 kills. 3 arcs were in the mid 20s, and one was in the teens, and the 3 in the 20s were all shooting the same, with the one in the teens shooting noticeably slower.

This should be easy enough to check in the tags right...?

Aye, simple to prove one way or the other.

About a year ago Krok made a similar question about TSG vets and I had looked into it. The TSG tagset does indeed alter some of the default units to have custom max vet limits. Was it even Baak who ported TSG? I know he got permission to host it, but I always thought someone else had ported it. I am unsure who then.

To see the exact values, get UnTag from the Tain. Use the "dissassemble" option somewhere in the menu options. Make sure your local is empty before extracting the tags from that plugin. Then load up Fear and check in the "monsters" section. Any default unit (berserk, archer, etc) with a white icon instead of a gray one means it was altered. Open those and click on the "Flags" button found around the bottom right side of the window near the OK and Cancel buttons. Then near the bottom right you will see a "Max. Experience:" value. That will be what you are looking for. If the number is negative then just do some simple math and subtract that from 256. For example, if the value was -106 just subtract that from 256 to get the number it means. Which in this case would be 150. You won't see negative values unless the max experience values are higher than 127.

the TSG solo campaign is amazing, but the multiplayer levels don't play that well. Too much terrain, and there is always 1 or 2 units that overpowers all else. Like on maps with disciples and warg riders, the disciple has almost the range, and can obliterate the arcs. I still think they are fun and a changeup, but its just a shame the maps weren't more player friendly. Some of them are massive, and nobody wants to spend the first 3 minutes of the game walking to a closer proximity to do battle.

http://tain.totalcodex.net/items/show/tsg-map-pack

much better multiplayer maps

Pyro wrote:About a year ago Krok made a similar question about TSG vets and I had looked into it. The TSG tagset does indeed alter some of the default units to have custom max vet limits. Was it even Baak who ported TSG? I know he got permission to host it, but I always thought someone else had ported it. I am unsure who then.

GHOST did the original TSG 1.4 changes.

Yep, I'm just hosting it on the OoH Creation Mirror.

I thought about porting the units to the Anywhere series, but it ended up in the "maybe at a later date" category.