Hey Prospective Hax00rs,
Found a way to allow dwarfs and whatnot to gain experience from their satchel charges.
The experience will be given to the dwarf who laid the latchel charges.
To do this, uncheck the 'Is dormant at rest' Flag on the satchel charge projectile.
Simple. Should be really useful, hope this is new news.
If you're unbeliving, try it for yourself or check out my plug, Myth+ v4.2.3 (still beta testing) for proof.
Satchel Charge Suggestion - Vetting Satchel Charges
dwarves already get experience from satchels they drop, though kills will not be counted if the satchel goes to burning and then promotes back to non-burning at any point. similarly with grenades, if a grenade goes dud and then gets blown up, its damage being responsible for a kill later on, the dwarf who threw it will not get that kill.
i don't think the "dormant at rest" flag makes any difference in this matter, but if the projectile does not go dormant it's still taking up processor time and various slots in arrays and memory that are better-used elsewhere. iow, if there are too many non-dormant projectiles some things will not work as expected. perhaps iron or myrd could clarify or correct me if i'm wrong...
i don't think the "dormant at rest" flag makes any difference in this matter, but if the projectile does not go dormant it's still taking up processor time and various slots in arrays and memory that are better-used elsewhere. iow, if there are too many non-dormant projectiles some things will not work as expected. perhaps iron or myrd could clarify or correct me if i'm wrong...
*toot*
-
Pistol_Pete
- Posts: 183
- Joined: Sun Mar 21, 2004 3:45 pm
- Location: Massachusetts, USA.
I recall hearing that bungie decided to not have stangant items - dudded duff bottles, dud pus shots and satchels - count toward anyone's positive damage since they figured it'd be too difficult for them to figure out. I know that the new beta patch for Doom III addresses this problem in multiplayer, as people were not origionally given kills for players that were killed via shooting and detonating explosive barrels.
Im not sure if Jagman really thought much about it untell I tried his plugin and kept saying "omg omg omfg". Iv always wonderd way a well placed fire arrow or fireball when killing opponents with satchels or bottles didnt count as a kill.
After playing Jagmans Myth+ I decided to go through the WWII plugin and found that most stationary objects become dormant...does that mean that you dont get kills for Claymores or Mines?
If nothing else its good to know that it works that way for future refferances. I figured that it would take more CPU memory for objects like that and if you went overkill...say signal flar of 100 satchels dropping from the sky then mb its a good idea to make those type dormant.
After playing Jagmans Myth+ I decided to go through the WWII plugin and found that most stationary objects become dormant...does that mean that you dont get kills for Claymores or Mines?
If nothing else its good to know that it works that way for future refferances. I figured that it would take more CPU memory for objects like that and if you went overkill...say signal flar of 100 satchels dropping from the sky then mb its a good idea to make those type dormant.
Not to my knowledge, or the knowledge of anyone ive asked, or probably anyone they know, do satchel charges give experience to the dwarf. Doesnt happen in coop, is it different for multi ffa's etc.?
Good point however about the extra memory non-dormant objects take. But is this effect extensive? Every single body part in mazzarin's demise is non-dormant, so as to allow bio-degrading. Which takes me to point two, the max proj count is greatly rising while other measures (bio-degrading) mean less ambient projectiles litter a map. the scene is set for a little extra memory allocation.
If the abundance of non-dormant satchel charges is a problem for units such as the Demo Duff in mazz, one solution mught be to have the satchel sharge promote to a dormant version of itself - of course this would raise issues on ammunition... its a tricky world.
I really only want to point out that to the extent of my experimentation, the 'is dormant' flag strips the projectile of its ownership.
Happy Editing :;):
Good point however about the extra memory non-dormant objects take. But is this effect extensive? Every single body part in mazzarin's demise is non-dormant, so as to allow bio-degrading. Which takes me to point two, the max proj count is greatly rising while other measures (bio-degrading) mean less ambient projectiles litter a map. the scene is set for a little extra memory allocation.
If the abundance of non-dormant satchel charges is a problem for units such as the Demo Duff in mazz, one solution mught be to have the satchel sharge promote to a dormant version of itself - of course this would raise issues on ammunition... its a tricky world.
I really only want to point out that to the extent of my experimentation, the 'is dormant' flag strips the projectile of its ownership.
Happy Editing :;):
Also, promotion shouldnt strip a projectile of its ownership, myrk giant for example can obliterate heron guards with those damn skulls and reap the rewards.
And there just aint no way that the experience of a satchel trap could be transferred to a unit that 'sets it off' ie flame arrows. All the money goes to the duff who cleverly laid them, not the foolish arc who by sheer fluke set them off w/ a flame... Some dramatisation may have occured..
And there just aint no way that the experience of a satchel trap could be transferred to a unit that 'sets it off' ie flame arrows. All the money goes to the duff who cleverly laid them, not the foolish arc who by sheer fluke set them off w/ a flame... Some dramatisation may have occured..
yeah, if a dwarf lays a row of satchels and an archer with a flamer sets them off, the dwarf gets the kills.
you have a point about the krid giants, so i'm not entirely certain what the criteria are for registering kills. i know that dudded bottles (say, though dunking them in a river) don't confer experience, though, through years of observation. perhaps it has something to do with the transfer from being "on fire" to not "on fire"...
*shrug*
you have a point about the krid giants, so i'm not entirely certain what the criteria are for registering kills. i know that dudded bottles (say, though dunking them in a river) don't confer experience, though, through years of observation. perhaps it has something to do with the transfer from being "on fire" to not "on fire"...
*shrug*
*toot*
True, when i began this post i hadn't considered that the fire flag might have some effect on this matter... but two absolutes on this matter,
(1) With the regular myth2 units, dwarfs do not get experience from damage dealt by satchel charges. Please note i said experience not kills. I'd gladly like to know how damage and kills are tallied in a team or ffa map where satchel traps are used, this'd be rare though as no-one is stupid enough to lead an army of stygs over a sat trap..
To test this (and this isnt exactly the same environment) i started 'The Baron' (normal myth2 solo, not chimaera) and laid 7 satchel charges in the mid doorway at the start. After drawing the main hallway stygs and blowing them sky-high (which was limited by the ceiling somewhat) i quit immediately and viewed the last recording. Heres what i noticed;
My dwarf had one vet bonus, despite 9 stygs being killed. The satchel charge / On fire charge promotion remains a possiblity, but a fairly slim one - i should ahve at least recieved 2 kills as the one i did recieve was from the bottle directly..
However on checking the post-game info, the light side team turned up 9 kills and 25 damage. So the game did record the kills, yet the dwarf recieved no vetting for them.
(2) My second note is that the only thing i changed in my plugin, which seems to turn up experience for the dwarf everytime, is the 'becomes dormant at rest' flag. my satchels can still promote to the burning projectile, at .55 possibility. QED my analysis.
U'll also note that dud bottles, pus packets etc. are all dormant at rest, so theres some more evidence.
For people who know the myth engine well (which I certainly don't), how viable is this memory wise? Also, any hard-core ww2'ers on comments about mines giving experience?
Regards, jag
(1) With the regular myth2 units, dwarfs do not get experience from damage dealt by satchel charges. Please note i said experience not kills. I'd gladly like to know how damage and kills are tallied in a team or ffa map where satchel traps are used, this'd be rare though as no-one is stupid enough to lead an army of stygs over a sat trap..
To test this (and this isnt exactly the same environment) i started 'The Baron' (normal myth2 solo, not chimaera) and laid 7 satchel charges in the mid doorway at the start. After drawing the main hallway stygs and blowing them sky-high (which was limited by the ceiling somewhat) i quit immediately and viewed the last recording. Heres what i noticed;
My dwarf had one vet bonus, despite 9 stygs being killed. The satchel charge / On fire charge promotion remains a possiblity, but a fairly slim one - i should ahve at least recieved 2 kills as the one i did recieve was from the bottle directly..
However on checking the post-game info, the light side team turned up 9 kills and 25 damage. So the game did record the kills, yet the dwarf recieved no vetting for them.
(2) My second note is that the only thing i changed in my plugin, which seems to turn up experience for the dwarf everytime, is the 'becomes dormant at rest' flag. my satchels can still promote to the burning projectile, at .55 possibility. QED my analysis.
U'll also note that dud bottles, pus packets etc. are all dormant at rest, so theres some more evidence.
For people who know the myth engine well (which I certainly don't), how viable is this memory wise? Also, any hard-core ww2'ers on comments about mines giving experience?
Regards, jag