myth2 1.8 suggestions

[vinylrake]

Judge Thread says "VR is the LAW" 4-0 VR well played.

thanks. i stopped arguing because i got bored trying to have an intelligent conversation with a dac-hole.

[dac]

vr finally beats dac at something myth related

of course its a game with a non objective referee, so its like winning a game in the NBA, except neither of us are getting paid

[vinylrake]

vr finally beats dac at something myth related

oh yeah? i beat you at DeathMatch all the time, suckah!

[dac]

i believe we played one deathmatch game where i got the best start and since it ws on raid or demise or soemthing i wound up with all the time and the closest person was in the 10 second vicinity for suiciding units in a great order to get close enough to contest.

anyway, i dont remember losing any deathmatch gmaes to you!

[Lord Thanos]

Forgive me if this has already been suggested, I just wanted to see if this idea is within the realm of possibility. Could units be given a "kneel" action, whereby they would crouch down allowing ranged units to fire over their heads? A key-press would result in a kneeling sequence, and their unit size would be reduced. The unit would be unable to move while kneeling, but would present a protective barrier from a melee assault approaching from the front (without impeding ranged attacks from the friendly units they are guarding).

This idea came to mind while I was playing one of my favorite plugins, Legends of Gor-Ash. The wolves are small enough in size that Bre'unor can hurl jawbones over top of them without obstruction.

I suppose it might be easier to just use short melee units, but even dwarves seem to impede some ranged units, particularly at close-range. Any solution that would avoid having to create unique kneeling animations for each melee unit would be the way to go.

I have noticed that dwarven hereos are able to lob their molotov's vertically while still achieving respectable horizontal distance, but they are unwilling to attack when they perceive an obstruction (even when their lobbing technique would prevent an unsightly accident). Fetch seem more willing to attack around blocking friendly units, perhaps their AI could be adapted to units like the Dwarf, so that they will attack if the situation allows for it (kneeling/short units in the way, modified firing technique etc.)

Just throwing this out there, as you magicians seem to have ways of working technical miracles

[heinzoliger]

Just one suggestion :
In the list of the plugins, why not having a color by plugin based on what it contains.
In the list of the plugins, we could have different colors for :
- tagset
- multiplayer only
- solo only
- multiplayer + solo

It's sometimes confusing when we have lots of plugins.

Or simpler, filter the plugin list for the solo play to only show solo and tagset plugins.

What do you think about it ?
Don't think it's hard to code. It may slow down the launch of the game though.

[ColonelSandersLite]

Hi, I've recently rediscovered myth, digging through an old box. I'm very surprised someone's still updating it. I've now played TFL on normal, vTFL on legendary and soulblighter on normal.

Something that I for one would *really* like to see is modern style unit grouping.

Ctrl + number sets the group
Just pressing a number recalls the group
In order to change formations use alt + number (e.g. alt+1 is short line)

I suppose it would be somewhat easier and a good compromise to do:

Holding down a number sets the group
Just pressing a number recalls the group
In order to change formations use alt + number (e.g. alt+1 is short line)

Rationalization:
Given that myth 2 remembers unit formations (big improvement over tfl imho), I don't tend to change a groups formation very often once it's set up, but I do switch between groups a lot. For example, my bowmen are in long line formation 95% of the time. I usually set their formation exactly once, at the start of the mission and never change it again (sometimes I end up resetting it a couple of times at most). I do end up having to hit alt+number (usually 3) to recall their group like 20+ times every mission. So why should the action that gets used most require a modifier key while the action that gets used least doesn't?

Of course, I would suggest making it optional so that the people who still want the old grouping can keep playing as if it never changed, but everyone else can use the more modern style.

I'm actually surprised that this wasn't changed 5 years ago.

[oogaBooga]

Forgive me if this has already been suggested, I just wanted to see if this idea is within the realm of possibility. Could units be given a "kneel" action, whereby they would crouch down allowing ranged units to fire over their heads? A key-press would result in a kneeling sequence, and their unit size would be reduced. The unit would be unable to move while kneeling, but would present a protective barrier from a melee assault approaching from the front (without impeding ranged attacks from the friendly units they are guarding).

This idea came to mind while I was playing one of my favorite plugins, Legends of Gor-Ash. The wolves are small enough in size that Bre'unor can hurl jawbones over top of them without obstruction.

I suppose it might be easier to just use short melee units, but even dwarves seem to impede some ranged units, particularly at close-range. Any solution that would avoid having to create unique kneeling animations for each melee unit would be the way to go.

I have noticed that dwarven hereos are able to lob their molotov's vertically while still achieving respectable horizontal distance, but they are unwilling to attack when they perceive an obstruction (even when their lobbing technique would prevent an unsightly accident). Fetch seem more willing to attack around blocking friendly units, perhaps their AI could be adapted to units like the Dwarf, so that they will attack if the situation allows for it (kneeling/short units in the way, modified firing technique etc.)

Just throwing this out there, as you magicians seem to have ways of working technical miracles

It's more than just possible - its already been done! If you've got a unit collection with that animation, it's just a simple tweak - but without the animation (IE most normal myth units dont have something usable for that purpose) it would be pointless.

[oogaBooga]

Hi, I've recently rediscovered myth, digging through an old box. I'm very surprised someone's still updating it. I've now played TFL on normal, vTFL on legendary and soulblighter on normal.

Something that I for one would *really* like to see is modern style unit grouping.

Ctrl + number sets the group
Just pressing a number recalls the group
In order to change formations use alt + number (e.g. alt+1 is short line)

I suppose it would be somewhat easier and a good compromise to do:

Holding down a number sets the group
Just pressing a number recalls the group
In order to change formations use alt + number (e.g. alt+1 is short line)

Rationalization:
Given that myth 2 remembers unit formations (big improvement over tfl imho), I don't tend to change a groups formation very often once it's set up, but I do switch between groups a lot. For example, my bowmen are in long line formation 95% of the time. I usually set their formation exactly once, at the start of the mission and never change it again (sometimes I end up resetting it a couple of times at most). I do end up having to hit alt+number (usually 3) to recall their group like 20+ times every mission. So why should the action that gets used most require a modifier key while the action that gets used least doesn't?

Of course, I would suggest making it optional so that the people who still want the old grouping can keep playing as if it never changed, but everyone else can use the more modern style.

I'm actually surprised that this wasn't changed 5 years ago.

The unit grouping you refer to are called "presets" and have existed since TFL - just hold down command on a mac or alt on a pc and also hold down the number you wish it to represent - and recall it by simply hitting alt+number quickly.

[Pyro]

He means, he would like it the other way around. Instead of pressing a number for a formation and using Alt plus numbers for presets, have it switched. He suggests this because he uses presets often while setting formations only a few times since they remain persistant throughout the rest of the game.

[ColonelSandersLite]

Exactly as pyro says. I know I'm a new face here, but seriously man, how could you think that I made it through both games without figuring that out?

I know that presets (in myth parlance, unit/battle groups in every other game in existence) already exist. I would just like the way calling them is handled changed to a more modern style as an option.

It's pretty obvious someone has the source code and I would most likely be willing to make the necessary modifications myself since I'm actually a software engineer. Assuming that it was coded in a logical fashion (95% likely) I would probably have to spend more time finding the relevant sections than actually changing them. The hardest part would be integrating the option in the preferences screen, but that shouldn't be too hard either. Come to think of it, the hardest part might be finding a good place to put it in the preferences screen. IIRC, it's pretty packed.

[GodzFire]

A software engineer eh? Would you consider offering some of your freetime to help with updating Myth's code?

[ColonelSandersLite]

I could do some. Perhaps help with bug fixes mostly. My time is limited though so I wouldn't expect me to spend too much time with it. It shouldn't really be too necessary anyways.

In the time I've been playing myth, I have experienced exactly one crash in tfl (after alt tabbing) and none in soulblighter. I have noticed no bugs at all, though I must admit I haven't really looked for them. I know that there are documented minor scripting errors in a few levels that mostly just show up if you try to deliberately break them, but again, nothing major.

The few problems I've had are related to the mediocre pathfinding which is simply due to the sheer age of the game. Honestly, changing that too much would change the face of the game if you know what I mean.

It *would* be interesting to take a look at the code and see if proper 3d units would be possible to implement. Any system built in the last 5 years should have more than enough oomph to handle it easilly. The biggest problem I can see with that (without having inspected the code) would be finding people willing to make the models. Again, this is a change that would change the game a lot so I dunno if I would actually want to do it.

I have to be honest and say I really like myth the way it is. The only real annoyance I have with it is the way you have to press alt to recall the unit groupings.

I'm sure there's performance optimizations that could be made, but again, just due to the age of the game, any hardware that's relatively modern has enough power that this is rendered moot.

[vinylrake]

well if you are looking for 3D units, there's always Myth III....

[carlinho]

Lord Thanos wrote:Forgive me if this has already been suggested, I just wanted to see if this idea is within the realm of possibility. Could units be given a "kneel" action, whereby they would crouch down allowing ranged units to fire over their heads? A key-press would result in a kneeling sequence, and their unit size would be reduced. The unit would be unable to move while kneeling, but would present a protective barrier from a melee assault approaching from the front (without impeding ranged attacks from the friendly units they are guarding).

it's definitely possible with 1.7
by artifacts you can change monster behavior
so you can just click 2 keys and you switch artifact (to a kneeling artifact) and voila...


example of unit that through inventory they KNEEL
http://hl.udogs.net/files/Uploads/%20Us ... /wwii4.jpg

CROUCH--obviously to hide from bullets, and also when they crouch their selection box is really small

http://hl.udogs.net/files/Uploads/%20Us ... /wwii5.jpg